2022年8月6日土曜日

All In With Chris Hayes [FULL 8PM] 8/5/22 MSNBC Breaking News | 5 August...

All In With Chris Hayes [FULL 8PM] 8/5/22 MSNBC Breaking News | 5 August...

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All In With Chris Hayes [FULL 8PM] 8/5/22 MSNBC Breaking News | 5 August...


6:45
stephanie let me start with you put these jobs numbers in context how good are they how big are they?


they're huge they blindsided virtually everyone as you said in your opening many we we didn't see this coming economists analysts wall street forecasters everybody missed this one.
this was a blockbuster number 528 000 jobs and job revisions to the previous two months.
 so the reports that we got last month and the month before are being revised upwards so we have some very very good news when it comes to you know the labor market um this is broad-based.
 i mean it's everything from leisure and hospitality to manufacturing and construction.
 and uh government jobs it's uh business and it is across the whole of our economy.
 we are seeing extreme uh robust job creation and resilience in the labor market.
…
9:35
stephanie two quarters of negative growth traditionally means recession half a million jobs in a month traditionally means not a recession are we in a recession?

well many they're very difficult to call in real time.
 we usually don't know we are in a recession until months sometimes even a year or more uh after we've entered one.
 i i have to say you you're you're gonna find it pretty hard for me to come out and tell you that we're in a recession at the moment given the job numbers that we just saw today um it's a mixed picture.
there's no question that you can look for data points in this economy and you can spot signs of weakness no question but job numbers like the kind that we saw today send.
 i think a pretty strong signal that the consumer hasn't uh retrenched this is what you're watching for you're watching your consumers to start closing up their wallets and pocketbooks and spending less and then businesses see customers disappearing.
 and that's where you begin to see signs of trouble this is a good thing when people got get jobs when they find jobs.
 and they have income to spend it's a good way to support an economic recovery.
 so um it gets more difficult to buy into the recession narrative despite that sort of conventional rule of thumb about two consecutive quarters.




6:45
ステファニー まずはこの雇用統計の数字について教えてください。


この数字は非常に大きく、事実上すべての人を驚かせた。あなたが冒頭で述べたように、多くのエコノミストやアナリスト、ウォール街の予想屋がこの数字を見落としたのだ。
これは超大型の数字で52万8000人の雇用と前2ヶ月の雇用修正です。
 先月と先々月の報告が上方修正されたわけですから、労働市場に関しては非常に良いニュースです。
 つまり、レジャーや接客業から製造業や建設業に至るまで、あらゆるものが含まれます。
 これはレジャー、サービス業、製造業、建設業、そして政府の仕事、ビジネスと、経済全体にわたっています。
 私たちは、労働市場において極めて強い雇用創出と回復力を見ています。
...
9:35
ステファニー 2四半期のマイナス成長は伝統的に不況を意味する 1ヶ月で50万人の雇用は伝統的に不況ではないことを意味する 我々は不況に陥っているのか？

まあ、多くの場合、リアルタイムで呼び出すのは非常に困難です。
 通常、不況に突入してから数ヶ月、時には1年以上経たないと、不況であることに気づかないのです。
 私は、今日見た雇用統計から、今が不景気だと言うのはかなり難しいと言わざるを得ない...複雑な状況だ。
この経済のデータポイントを探せば、弱さの兆候を見つけることができるのは間違いないが、今日見たような雇用統計は
 しかし、今日のような雇用統計は、消費者が退潮していないことを示すかなり強いシグナルだと思います。
 そして企業は顧客がいなくなるのを見ることになります。
 人々が仕事を見つけ、消費するための収入を得ることは、経済回復をサポートする良い方法です。
 だから、2四半期連続という従来の経験則にもかかわらず、不況のシナリオを信じるのは難しくなっています。


there are more people working in america than any point in american history the biden boom a jobs report so strong even fox can't deny it this is a blockbuster report this is much higher than anybody was expecting tonight the string of victories for the biden administration and the big win possibly still to come we're actually helping the american people instead of just playing political games then the political payoff for doing the right thing i've been very clear i think he's uh guilty of the most serious dereliction of duty of any president in our nation's history reports of a quiet republican effort to try and save liz cheney's seat will it work plus the junior podcaster from texas and his performative outrage and a 50 million dollar judgment again alex jones for his sandy hook lies when all in starts right now good evening from washington dc i'm mehdi hassan in for chris hayes so it's friday morning the first friday of the month of august and you are a producer of fox the country is awaiting the july jobs report and even the white house has admitted that the numbers are going to be bad of course this is the story you go big on the jobs report is going to be lousy joe biden's economy is in the gutter the white house is already lowering expectations for the july jobs report due out later today the american economy is in terrible shape unfortunately while you know i understand the political consequences of that for the president we ought to lament that because as americans we really want everyone to flourish that job report is an indicator that america is really not flourishing there's some expectation that the jobs report will come in around 150 000 new jobs added which is much less than the half a million jobs that have been added over the last several months jobless claims were up yesterday above predictions you just think maybe the jobs report adding jobs might not be as high but then 8 30 a.m rolls around and the report comes out and it over the past year all of this is new strong evidence that the country has not entered a recession but if you work at fox and you just spent the morning telling your audience that the report was going to be terrible and the economy is in shambles what do you do well apparently you find a way to spin a really good jobs report into bad news we have the good news and the bad news here first the top line number the headline here this is a blockbuster report this is much higher than anybody was expecting the bad news this ensures that we are going to see a federal reserve that stays as aggressive as ever the bad news is is that the federal reserve will continue raising interest rates aggressively that's going to make our borrowing much more expensive and holding debt much more expensive i think it's probably the more important thing is participation the unemployment rate went to 3.5 percent from 3.6 but participation actually went down it's still somewhat amazing to me that we have not gotten back up to the same level of participation fox was so committed to this bit that they even criticized the white house for getting the number wrong take a look at that banner on screen white house misses forecast on lower july jobs growth i mean yeah they missed it but only because the report's so much better than anticipated they missed it in a good way fox of course has also really really been pushing the idea that we are in a recession and we can argue over technical definitions but i'm sorry it is very hard to say that we are in a recession when companies in america hired more than half a million people in a single month sure the american economy still has some problems but it's also doing quite well now fox cannot handle america doing well because that means that joe biden and the democrats are doing well they are pro-america patriots only when republicans are in charge of america democratic senator joe manchin of west virginia called them out on this the other day live on air the action president who is there to make a statement is like as low as congresses when you get into the 30s no one's that popular paris are you scared we're going to do something good it'll help our country and somewhere are you kidding services in the bible that's what we do we serve our fellow man and woman my father served i found myself cheering for joe manchin for the first time after he troll box like that but manchin is on a roll at the moment he made this massive 700 billion dollar deal that if it passes would do a lot of good on climate on health care and manchin and senate majority leader chuck schumer also know how also now have their final hold holdout arizona senator kirsten cinema on board they did have to make some changes to get her approval including removing a provision that would have limited the preferential tax treatment of income treated of income earned by some wealthy hedge fund managers and private equity executives sometimes called the carried interest loophole thank you senator cinema still democrats replaced that with a new 1 excise tax that companies would have to pay on the amount of stock that they repurchase which is a good thing that will raise more money and ensure that the package still reduces the federal deficit by as much as 300 billion dollars the same amount democrats aimed for with the original deal and if this deal goes through the house plans to vote on it a week from today it'll cap off a string of recent triumphs for joe biden and the democrats just in the past week we saw the killing of al-qaeda leader ayman al-zawahiri a major legislative achievement with the chips bill investing billions in semiconductor manufacturing and scientific research a huge win for abortion rights in kansas and these great jobs numbers today so should the white house should democrats dare to believe that they could make it through the november midterms with a better outcome than expected.

joining me now is stephanie kelton a former chief economist for the senate banking committee as well as a former economic advisor to bernie sanders 2016 and 2020 presidential campaigns.

and julian castro former mayor of san antonio texas former secretary of housing and urban development under president obama thank you both.

stephanie let me start with you put these jobs numbers in context how good are they how big are they?


they're huge they blindsided virtually everyone as you said in your opening many we we didn't see this coming economists analysts wall street forecasters everybody missed this one this was a blockbuster number 528 000 jobs and job revisions to the previous two months so the reports that we got last month and the month before are being revised upwards so we have some very very good news when it comes to you know the labor market um this is broad-based i mean it's everything from leisure and hospitality to manufacturing and construction and uh government jobs it's uh business and it is across the whole of our economy we are seeing extreme uh robust job creation and resilience in the labor market.

so julian president biden spoke today about how hard it is for some americans to see and feel the good in this jobs report because he conceded there is inflation that's still being dealt with have a listen i know people will hear today's extraordinary jobs report and say they don't see it they don't feel it in their own lives i know how hard it is i know it's hard to feel good about job creation when you already have a job and you're dealing with rising prices food gas and so much more i get it that's why i'm doing everything in my power to lower the cost for families julian in the long run is inflation going to overshadow these great jobs numbers well many i mean there's no question that people feel that on a daily basis at the same time gas prices have been falling for several weeks now uh i think something like 50 days in a row these are fantastic jobs numbers and so what you saw the president doing there was something that he has to do which is not only to celebrate uh the progress that we're making on the economy and there is a lot of progress 3.5 unemployment rate the lowest that's been measured in 50 years nine and a half million jobs created under this administration but also recognize uh the challenge the difficulty that still exists for american families and he told i thought a story that people could relate to of as a young man sitting at the dinner table with his parents as they talked about how they were going to afford uh the next month's uh rent or food and a lot of people can relate to that conversation so he did both of those things that he needs to do to take credit for uh the good stuff the progress but also to make sure that people who are still struggling out there understand that they have a president that hasn't forgotten about them and is going to keep working to make things better for them.

stephanie two quarters of negative growth traditionally means recession half a million jobs in a month traditionally means not a recession are we in a recession?

well many they're very difficult to call in real time we usually don't know we are in a recession until months sometimes even a year or more uh after we've entered one i i have to say you you're you're gonna find it pretty hard for me to come out and tell you that we're in a recession at the moment given the job numbers that we just saw today um it's a mixed picture there's no question that you can look for data points in this economy and you can spot signs of weakness no question but job numbers like the kind that we saw today send i think a pretty strong signal that the consumer hasn't uh retrenched this is what you're watching for you're watching your consumers to start closing up their wallets and pocketbooks and spending less and then businesses see customers disappearing and that's where you begin to see signs of trouble this is a good thing when people got get jobs when they find jobs and they have income to spend it's a good way to support an economic recovery so um it gets more difficult to buy into the recession narrative despite that sort of conventional rule of thumb about two consecutive quarters.


 julian some democrats have been dodging the question of whether joe biden should run again does this week of success not just the jobs report but the zawahiri killing the chip packed bill does this put some of those concerns about his re-election prospects to rest or are there more fundamental issues that he still has to deal with well i mean i think the fundamental issue is you have midterm elections elections that are coming up in just a few months and so i think everybody's focus is on those midterms and uh people say you know nothing succeeds like success and uh this last week or so has been a week of real success for the president and for democrats uh whether you're talking about this news on the economy or the fact that uh he's gonna get big legislation done uh what happened in kansas uh that is showing that the democratic base out there is motivated on the abortion issue and is going to take that to the polls in november very likely things are looking a lot better right now than they were even just a couple of weeks ago julian quick last question we're almost out of time i got to ask you if you were managing the democrats campaign in november would you be running topmost on abortion rights or on republican extremism or on jobs in the economy i'd be running on republican extremism as as expressed by uh abortion but also january 6 and other things where they've shown themselves to be far outside the mainstream julian castro stephanie kelton thank you both for your time appreciate your analysis coming up the director of the fbi issues a new warning about far-right extremism texas podcaster ted cruz throws a tantrum the dangers of the current republican rhetoric that's next i understand that passions run high especially on an abortion uh but they're just way too many people who seem to think that it that that justifies engaging in violence uh and and destruction of property and threats of violence you mentioned molotov cocktails i feel like every day i'm getting briefed on somebody throwing a molotov cocktail at someone for some issue uh it's crazy that was fbi director chris moray warning about a spike that the fbi is seeing in politically motivated violence in this country but not everyone seemed to be focused on the real danger of rising political violence in this country podcaster senator ted cruz was allowed in the hearing because he is a united states senator and he used to be already it was reported that project veros had obtained a copy of an fbi training material which listed various symbols and themes which in the fbi's estimation were indicative of quote militia violent extremism also included on this is a texan i was particularly struck is the gonzales battle flag come and take it as indicative of being a violent extremist militia well i will self-report right now that every day in the senate i wear my boots that have the gonzales battle flag on the back of them beyond the pearl clutching from all boots no cattle republicans like ted cruz you can tell a nerve has been struck republicans don't particularly like being lumped in with every extremist group and domestic terrorist and hey welcome to my world hey conservatives you might actually find some but let's not take this too far it's not like there's a gitmo for january 6 rioters although wait there was this booth at cpac in texas today where you're meant to watch a maga hat wearing prisoner cry as you listen to a headset playing testimony of the people arrested for rioting on january the sixth you know an example of the very right-wing political violence that director ray has been trying to warn us about asha rangapa is a former special agent in the new york division of the fbi specializing in counter-intelligence investigations as well as an editor at the just security blog and she joins me now ashley thanks for coming on the show the director of the fbi called politically motivated violence quote almost a 365-day phenomenon how does that compare to your time in the fbi and how concerned are you should we be well maybe thank you thank you for having me on um i am very concerned and this is a shift right i mean in my time at the fbi the terrorism threat was international terrorism it was al qaeda it was isis and that's where the fbi's resources were focused last year the national security council released a demand a strategy to counter domestic terrorism and it identified the growing threat of domestic terrorism and specifically two different types of domestic terrorism one is racial racially motivated extremist violence and the other is militia extremist violence and both of these are on the rise and so what the fbi is doing is dovetailing with that national strategy and they're coordinating with other intelligence partners and that document which um ted cruz was was pointing to is really a descriptive document about specifically militia violent extremists and what they have observed with anti-government and anti-law enforcement groups and how they express their shared ideology through these symbols which groups are going to do terrorist groups are going to do importantly at the top of that document behind him it says that they should not independently be used to um you know assess that someone is engaged in illegal activity well thank you for putting that in context i'm i'm the last person who's going to defend the fbi's handling of any terrorist threats given what happened to a lot of muslims in america in the last 20 years but i find it ironic that conservatives are kind of gnashing and wailing right now we have this weird scenario where every time the fbi or the dhs tries to warn about the threat from right-wing domestic terrorism conservatives republicans say we're being targeted well no only if you're admitting to being domestic terrorists there's a weird conflation going on by the right well unfortunately maybe this is increasingly their base that they are appealing to i mean not all of them are terrorists but clearly if they're sympathetic to the people who attacked the capital and wanted to kill lawmakers and hang the vice president which they explicitly are they feel like it's a hoax to be you know even investigating it then they are appealing to that subset of people and i've said since january 6 2021 that we basically have a domestic terror movement in this country that has representation in congress and i think imagine maybe if after 9 11 you had congress people expressing sympathy for them um listening to you know detainees at guantanamo crying you know and and creating a uh uh that was repeated by a guest on steve bannon's show at cpac today it's about the irs which like many federal agencies had a law enforcement division have a listen they're stalking the irs with guns and ammo why are they doing this to go after we're going to go after corporations in the in the caymans that's like six people right you got 90 000 people you know why they're going to come after you they're going to be after you dr brooke yeah they're after everybody back there they're going to weaponize the irs use the government to intimidate every single trump supporter and magazine supporter in america asha as a former law enforcement agent what do you think when you hear people basically stoking untrue paranoia like that where does that lead well it leads to political violence i mean what he's setting up there is a dichotomy between and he explicitly said between trump supporters and the government so the government is going to come after you if you're a trump supporter and this is kind of also in line with what i mentioned before about the militia violent extremists who based their ideology you know as anti-government anti-law enforcement it reminds me maybe of a while ago this is several decades ago but when the nra started adopting this narrative as well and they had a poster of uh fbi swat agents in crosshairs it actually made um george h.w bush renounce his life membership from the nra but that's what they're appealing to is this idea that the government can't be trusted law enforcement can't be trusted and it doesn't feed into the narrative that justifies what happened on january it really is 90s paranoia on steroids and just talking of right-wing extremists last quick question i want to ask you about a verdict that came down a few hours ago for punitive damages in the alex jones trial it was a pretty astonishing result as the judge read it have a listen question number one four million two hundred thousand dollars question number two twenty million five hundred thousand dollars question number three twenty million five hundred thousand dollars all right um this question is addressed to my jury is this your verdict so say each and all of you that's 45.2 million awarded against alex jones for his shameful lies about sandy hook your reaction well i think attacked with justice department officials in an apparent attempt to block access to conversations with his former top aides trump has also repeatedly reportedly excused me ignored advice to cut off contact with his former white house chief of staff mark meadows after aids to meadows cassidy hutchinson provided stunning testimony to the january 6 committee potentially singling out meadows as a key witness in the probe against the ex-president quinto jurassic is a senior editor of the law fair blog where she wrote today about the lessons and limits of the january 6 committee quinta thanks for coming on the show the committee and the doj are running almost in parallel but certainly at times on intersecting tracks which investigation do you think will ultimately have the biggest impact i think it's a question of understanding that you know these are really investigations that are doing different things the january sex committee of course doesn't have the power to bring an indictment they don't bring a criminal trial what they're doing really is more of kind of telling the story of what happened on january 6th building a public sort of moral and political case against donald trump and they're certainly pushing the justice department on the criminal aspect as well and what the justice department is doing is deciding whether to bring those higher level criminal cases and as you say pushing forward with these hundreds and hundreds of lower level charges and some significant charges of seditious conspiracy against the people who are actually rioting in the capital that day and quinta you wrote about the committee's limits the 1-6 committee's limits particularly that quote the january 6 investigators must assume that their work has a hard deadline of january 2023 and because of that there are surely difficult trade-offs being made around what to prioritize in the limited time that remains to finish this work do you think that limited time the deadline could prevent us from getting a full accounting of the crimes committed around the capital riot as my colleague and i molly reynolds wrote in that piece the committee has always known about that deadline there has always been that possibility very likelihood that republicans would take control of the house and not choose to renew the committee in the new the new congress so i think that they have been working with that in mind that said it's certainly true that you know they've said a lot about how these hearings have surfaced new evidence we saw the testimony of cassidy hutchinson the testimony of pat simpoloni following hutchinson's testimony the committee has said that new people are coming in and testifying so even as we see them kind of gathering momentum it's important to keep in mind they really only have a few months left before they have to put out this public report and so as impressive as their work has been i do think it's worth keeping in mind that they're really about to run up against a wall so what significance do you see in trump's lawyers talking directly to the doj is this a prelude to something or are we making a big deal out of a routine procedure so it certainly cautioned viewers not to get too excited we we saw reports like these during the mueller investigation and of course that did not result in any charges against donald trump but i think it is a reflection of how in recent weeks we have seen a lot of news reports that suggest that the justice department investigation is heating up we saw reports that uh white house counsel pat civiloni his deputy pat philbin were testifying before a federal grand jury there are a lot of indications that the department is at the very least looking very seriously and closely at trump's personal role in uh ginning up the violence on january 6 and the events ahead of it so i think this this new reporting reflects that you know trump like everyone else uh he reads the news his lawyers probably have have heard what's going on and as lawyers do they're taking steps to try to defend their client last quick question if we do get more public hearings out of the 1-6 committee what would you want to hear from them what would you want to prioritize in them so we're expecting to hear uh more from them in september they have promised that i think that they they have left a great deal open they've done an enormous amount in sketching out the sort of the broad strokes of what happened on january 6th um and trump's personal culpability i personally think that one of the big open questions that we have has to do with whether or not there was any knowledge or coordination between the trump camp and the white house and the folks on the ground on january 6 like the oath keepers like the proud boys that strikes me as something that you know if the committee uh brings to light any new evidence and that that could be potentially very groundbreaking indeed it could be quinta jurassic thank you so much for your time and for your reporting appreciate it thank you still ahead one of those notorious republicans in modern american politics is doing the right thing how should we react to that that debate coming up in 2020 congresswoman liz cheney of wyoming won the republican primary there by almost 50 points then donald trump staged a coup cheney became one of his most vocal critics and now she's trailing her election-denying opponent by double digits in this month's republican primary in wyoming unlike most her republican colleagues in the house since january 6 2021 cheney has consistently spoken out against trump as a unique threat to our democracy and after she agreed to become the vice chair of the committee investigating january vi she solidified her position as something of a republican pariah but it seems as though some of the party establishment may have changed their minds axios reporting that a handful of republican operatives are quietly working to boost cheney in her long shot primary signaling that there is in fact an appetite among a few old guard republicans to try and move on from donald trump but this is still an uphill battle for cheney so this week she brought out perhaps our most high-profile and loyal supporter to make the case in an ad in our nation's 246-year history there has never been an individual who is a greater threat to our republic than donald trump he tried to steal the last election using lies and violence to keep himself in power after the voters had rejected him he was a coward a real man wouldn't lie to his supporters he lost his election watching that i'm reminded of that great headline from the satirical site click hole heartbreaking the worst person you know just made a great point and dick cheney is certainly in the running for the title of worst person in modern american politics he is directly or indirectly responsible for some of the most cruel shameful and lawless episodes in recent american history and he's never been held to account for all the deaths and the bloodshed for the iraq war for torture for guantanamo bay and countless other calamities you could also argue that cheney's catastrophic reign is possibly the most powerful and consequential vice president ever lead the groundwork for trump's takeover of the republican party and his expansive view of unchecked executive power made the office of the president that much more dangerous once trump occupied it liz cheney isn't much better either she might be even more conservative than her father she voted with donald trump 93 of the time she continues to oppose among other things abortion rights voting rights and gun control and neither cheney especially dick has offered any kind of real public apology for their past embrace of donald trump both in 2016 and again in 2020 but here's the thing yes the cheneys have done considerable damage to america and american politics and yes the cheneys are a hundred percent right about the threat trump currently poses to american democracy you can hold both of those thoughts in your head at the same time as i do they're not mutually exclusive and consider this if the man who was once dubbed the prince of darkness and his right wing daughter if dick and liz say the republican party has gone off the rails
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