Stephanie Kelton On MMT and the Inflation We're Seeing Today
Has sky-high inflation discredited MMT?
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For years, economists of the MMT school have been arguing that the way we think about deficits and government spending is all wrong. Whereas many people warn about the unsustainability of the national debt -- likening it to a household credit card bill -- the MMT view is that real resources are the constraint on government spending, and that inflation is the sign that real resources are being stretched. So what about now? We had substantial fiscal support during the pandemic, and now we have the highest inflation in over four decades. On this episode we speak with Stephanie Kelton, a leading proponent of MMT, a professor at Stony Brook, and the cohost of the Best New Ideas In Money podcast. We discuss the causes of the current inflation, and how to think about it through the MMT lens. This episode was recorded in Beverly Hills at the Milken Institute Global Conference.
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Tracy: (06:06)
Can you break it down for us a little bit more? How much of the current inflation or price increases do you think are due to demand versus supply issues and energy prices and things like that?
Stephanie: (06:17)
Super hard, super hard to know the answer to that. Tracy, we were talking about that this morning on a panel that I was on with current CBO director, a former CBO director, and Jason Furman. We had exactly these kinds of conversations. I don't think anybody on the panel feels really comfortable dissecting at that level, you know, half a third, whatever. But we do know, and we have differences of opinion to be sure. Right. Jason thinks that more of the inflation is a result of the excessive fiscal support. And I think I put myself on the other side, which is that most of what we're still dealing with is, you know, pandemic-related and energy. Exactly where to put the numbers, I don't know. But when it comes to, you know, where to lay the bulk of the blame, I still come down on the side of, you know, pandemic and energy and now food. Ukraine.
トレイシー: (06:06)[下のアップル版では7:30]
もう少し詳しく説明していただけますか？現在のインフレや物価上昇のうち、需要対供給の問題やエネルギー価格などによるものはどのくらいだと思われますか？
ステファニー：(06:17)
その答えを知るのはとても難しいです。トレーシー、今朝、私が参加したパネルで、現CBO長官、元CBO長官、そしてジェイソン・ファーマンと、このことについて話していたんです。まさにこの種の会話をしました。パネルにいた誰もが、このようなレベル、つまり1/2や1/3といったレベルで分析することに違和感を覚えないのだと思います。しかし、私たちは知っていますし、意見の相違があることも確かです。そうですね。ジェイソンは、インフレの多くは過剰な財政支援の結果だと考えています。私は反対側で、まだ対処していることのほとんどは、パンデミック関連とエネルギー関連だと考えています。正確にはどこに数字を入れればいいのか、私にはわかりません。しかし、責任の所在をどこに置くかということになると、私はやはりパンデミックとエネルギー、そして今度は食糧、ウクライナの側に立つと思います。
https://t.co/Zq6o7oTcD5
— 地域通貨花子１ (@TiikituukaHana) May 20, 2022
7:30~ https://t.co/6X8CtriHYK pic.twitter.com/S8hSp5jKjJ
For years, economists of the MMT school have argued that the way we think about deficits and spending is all wrong.@StephanieKelton joins #OddLots to explain how to think about inflation through the MMT lens
— Bloomberg (@business) May 19, 2022
🎧 Apple: https://t.co/K1M7cGUVRY
🎧 Spotify: https://t.co/Si35JP9zH2 pic.twitter.com/YS9p7ZuYRv
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so we're now we've shifted the debate on to this new terrain.
and you hear you know secretary yellen going and giving speeches before the um world bank just recently and saying you know what the administration's basic macro approach is modern supply-side economics.
and and in the [ __ ] the shift that she's talking about there is exactly what you're talking about building capacity and dealing with supply side right re-shoring and building resilience and all that sort of stuff.
so i think mmt can play a role in that.
and you know we're not quite there in the sense that for janet yellen and the way she's talking about it.
you still have that adherence to the idea that everything needs to be deficit neutral.
and that keeping a deficit neutral is tantamount to keeping it inflation in neutral which it is not.
Apple Podcastでお聴きください: https://podcasts.apple.com/jp/podcast/odd-lots/id1056200096?i=1000562480937
Odd Lots
For years, economists of the MMT school have been arguing that the way we think about deficits and government spending is all wrong. Whereas many people warn about the unsustainability of the national debt -- likening it to a household credit card bill -- the MMT view is that real resources are the constraint on government spending, and that inflation is the sign that real resources are being stretched. So what about now? We had substantial fiscal support during the pandemic, and now we have the highest inflation in over four decades. On this episode we speak with Stephanie Kelton, a leading proponent of MMT, a professor at Stony Brook, and the cohost of the Best New Ideas In Money podcast. We discuss the causes of the current inflation, and how to think about it through the MMT lens. This episode was recorded in Beverly Hills at the Milken Institute Global Conference. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
ステファニー・ケルトン 「MMTと現在のインフレについて
奇妙な数々
長年にわたり、MMT学派の経済学者たちは、赤字や政府支出についての考え方はすべて間違っていると主張してきた。多くの人が国の借金が持続不可能であることを警告し、それを家庭用クレジットカードの請求書に例えるのに対し、MMTの見解は、真の資源が政府支出に対する制約であり、インフレは真の資源が引き伸ばされていることの表れであるというものであった。では、今はどうなのか。パンデミック時には相当な財政支援があったのに、今は40年以上ぶりの高インフレになっています。このエピソードでは、MMTの主要な提唱者であり、ストーニーブルックの教授、そしてBest New Ideas In Moneyポッドキャストの共同ホストであるステファニー・ケルトンにお話を伺います。現在のインフレの原因、そしてMMTのレンズを通してそれをどう考えるかについて議論しています。このエピソードは、ビバリーヒルズで開催されたミルケン研究所グローバルカンファレンスで収録されました。プライバシーに関する情報はomnystudio.com/listenerをご覧ください。
Apple Podcastでお聴きください: https://podcasts.apple.com/jp/podcast/odd-lots/id1056200096?i=1000562480937
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